The reasons why we need to protect our city from buildings growing taller in our downtown and why we need a charter change--
No matter what city staff has to say about a hotel enterprise district and no matter how interesting all these little graphics and propaganda is that they and height advocates are spewing--these are facts that they don't want you to know:
- HRPB can approve demolition of historic structures in order to assemble multiple properties for larger development—without a vote of the residents. HRPB has a documented history of doing this.
- P&Z can approve variances for everything in the LDRs except land use and density-- without a vote of the residents. P&Z has a documented history of doing this.
- P&ZB can approve a “planned development,” which allows “relaxing or waiving of height, setback, lot dimensions, lot area requirements, an increase in density and/or a decrease in minimum living area per dwelling unit”-- without a vote of the residents. I believe the Lucerne is a planned development as well as Hammon Park.
- The Commission can change any or all of the language in the LDRs--without a vote of the residents.
- The Commission can amend the comprehensive plan at any time--without a vote of the residents. And there is little oversight in Tallahassee anymore.
YES on Amendment 2
19 comments:
If the opposition wants to comment on the referendum, I am requesting that they use their true and complete name. If you want to remain anonymous, it will not be posted. Thanks.
We citizens are left out in the cold AT ALL LEVELS of government when it comes to growth decisions.Politicians AT ALL LEVELS don't listen to their voters,they listen to their campaign contributors.We have to protect ourselves against corruption and un-elected ,unaccountable,out of control future boards by making sure that we pass this.Lake Worth's future depends on it.Katie Mcgiveron
Gee, my comment was THAT good huh? What ends up happening EVERY TIME is you and your anti group attack teh commenter, not the comment, which you cannot refute.
I followed your rules and did not insult anyone. I spoke to your issue. But I'm not surprised that you would change rules in the middle of an important debate just because a commenter sounds more reasoned than your emotional "facts", I believe.
I'll remain anonymous as I'm not an expert. The experts have spoken and are speaking. They are then attacked at biased, knowing what side their bread is buttered on etc.
You can see Lake Worth dying.
What do you do? "YES" Kick it.
I'm not "opposition"--i'm trying to keep an open mind on this until I understand the issue fully. As a relative newcomer, there's a lot of history i don't know--and history seems to be what's driving this.
I agree with much of what you say in your post. If the economy heats up again & money starts flying around, how can we keep things under control--keep Lake Worth the attractive city it is--quite distinct from the mega 'burbs to the west full of endlessly repeating franchises and the glittering ostentation in most of the water-side cities to the north & south.
The Lucerne offends me. (Not the people who live in it, Greg.) It violated the zoning regs in place at the time. it has none of the "public benefits" of the new long range plan. The setback on the street is far less than even in front of Andy's shop. It represents what happens when greed overcomes community good.
The height of the building bothers me least of all, though. Urban density is far better than suburban sprawl. Designed properly, six stories is not a sun-blocking breeze-sucking monster. It's rooftop gardens and balconies cascading with flowers & vines. They do it well in Europe--have been for some time. I'd rather have tall buildings than endless strip malls that require shopping by automobile.
I'd like to know more about how Lucerne happened--who profited & who allowed it to happen. All I hear is "You don't want to know" or "I wasn't here then". It wasn't that long ago. How would we prevent that sort of thing under our existing processes? How have our processes changed since then? Are the commissioners so different now than they were then? If we don't learn from history...
The Gulfstream we'd all like to save is tall. The Dollar Store that squats on a showcase position in our community is short. I like the Gulfstream better. We don't have a view of the water from downtown now. A six-story building doesn't block views more than a four-story building.
Economic viability drives height. We need development--good development. Our revenue can't support our city. I can't pay any more in taxes--can you? We have to attract developers. Will this amendment help?
I want to hear how your amendment will help us out of our economic doldrums and protect us from greed. It has to work both ways. Are you going to have any open meetings to present your side?
I'm disappointed by the acrimony on both sides--the good guy/bad guy atmosphere. I think we all want Lake Worth to be a great place to live. We want businesses to locate here so residents have jobs near home. We want developers to profit who risk capital to build good buildings. We don't want to give up city services like park maintenance because we don't have enough tax revenue. We don't want to be all section 8 housing. I'm really worried that this amendment will send the wrong message & capital will go elsewhere. Is there no better way to make sure that bad things don't happen? I really don't know the answer to that question.
Thanks
Ted
Mr. Anonymous--I asked nicely. Post under your real name. Any coward can say anything under anonymous.
This is MY issue that I support 100%. I don't need you coming here in your attack mode or bringing up another issue of mine that I supported 100%, Florida Hometown Democracy.
So, go on the other blog and post to your heart's content. I have made it very clear that this is an advocacy site. I will not put up with people who want to rip apart my opinions and beliefs to make nasty comments against this referendum.
Again, if you have points, stay transparent, not in the shadows. Let the people here know who they are dealing with and then perhaps we will understand your motivation.
I post anonymously because you have people in this town that have called or wrote letters to possible employers for former town staff casting them in a negative light. Also guys like Mark Perella who drove slowly by Mrs. Watermans home and yelled for her to pack up and get out of town, then he gets a award for citizen of the year. Call me a coward if you will, but that's true and scary stuff.
My motivation? You've got to be kidding! Obviously, I am a real estate mogul or an evil developer which is such BS.
That is exactly what I'm referring to. Tell everyone here who you are so we can mount an attack on your character.
Again, I followed your rules and YOU changed them. That's your right. Yes you have an advocacy blog and you bring up topics and we discuss them.
I happen to think we could use a hotel. My opinion. I happen to think the only logical place for a new one is in the area East of Federal unless you want a quaint "low rise" hotel like the luxurious Hummingbird.
William Waters, who I happen to think knows what he is talking about disputes your assertion that you can build a financially viable hotel in that area with all the amenities you'd expect at a nice hotel with parking and restaurants and shops and keep it under 6 floors.
He also states he thinks the ONLY way the Gulfstream becomes viable is to build on to it. Now I agree that you may NOT have to build up to it's current height (100'), but it might be easier to make it work if more could be put up-front and allowing the same type of architecture as what already exists.
So, if you don't want our historically significant landmark to become some type of re-hab or retirement home or a convalescent center, you might want to leave your options open.
Again, I'm no expert. But the experts agree with me.
I could care less what the heights are reduced to in the real downtown area. Make em all single story if you want. Where are you supposed to park? How's that for quaint.
As there has been NO, ZERO, ZILCH commercial development in Lake Worth for the past two years contributing to the city losing MORE value than any of our neighboring cities in Palm Beach County, if anyone, EVIL DEVELOPERS included, even hinted at wanting to build a viable, mixed use structure in our Hotel District, we should roll out the red carpet for him. Instead you guys will throw eggs at it like you did at Starbucks when they opened. How's that for quaint?
And you guys just keep slinging it. Still afraid of posting under your name?
Get the right price for the Gulfstream, find the right buyer to add on another 4 stories and a parking garage or figure out a way to demolish it. You guys are good at that I hear.
The last time I heard, we have been in an economic decline. It is not conducive for anyone to be building right now. Heights is not the deterrent. It is the economy. Get a grip on reality.
I can find experts agreeing with me all day long. Expert witnesses are bought and paid for. Staff is on the side that pays their paycheck, usually, unless you are half nuts. Thanks very much.
Parking has always been an issue in our downtown. Build a 4 story garage somewhere. And while we are on that subject, what ever happened to that public parking we were to get with the Lucerne. That's why people don't trust you.
Please stick to the subject of the blog...no political propaganda please. No one can dispute the facts here.
No one is even trying to dispute the facts of where Lake Worth is in the pecking order of cities in Palm Beach County. On a good day, we are either the laughing stock or the armpit.
What might be in dispute is how this amendment helps either that image or our overall economic health.
Could you please explain?
Instead, I would like you to explain why you think we are the laughing stock or the armpit. Obviously, you should move to a city where you think of it in much better terms. Perhaps Miami or Ft. Lauderdale might be more to your liking where they have high buildings and crime is minimal.
3 votes from the Dais
or
We the People Votes
That is the bottom line for me!
The Lawyer is clueless about the "Supremacy Clause" in the Constitution where we are GUARANTEED a Representative Form of Government.
Not promised or we'll try - GUARANTEED!
He seems to think some silly law that says '3 trumps we' is gonna float in a free country.
Hello Lake Worth Employee's
"You are NOT the Boss of Me/We"
We are the Boss of YOU! - got it, get it? When you nudge push shove and force US - resistance is to be EXPECTED - we just r not that stupid and I am wondering how smart u r that u think we will just sit back and 'let u do this to us'?
Might want to read the Declaration of Independence and see how we handled those "Acts of Pretended Legislation"
back then. "Rightful Remedies"!
Then move onto DemocratsAgainstUNAgenda21.com
California is ahead of US in implementing Agenda 21 and it isn't good! The gal who began the site is an Expert Witness for DOT State of CA that TESTIFIES in Court on property values. She saw this coming and IS making the biggest bipartisan effort to educate the people to the UN origin of these UNAMERICAN New Normal.
Principles that destroy Individual Rights and Promote the Community's Rights are WRONG in AMERICA. Where that crap is written is beyond me but he who has control of the mic and can spread propaganda w/out question is the winner - Just shut up, sit down and eat the 'salad we serve'!
Uhhhh - Hell NO!
Since it's obvious you can't defend how this will hurt Lake Worth's ability to drag itself off the bottom of the barrel, I'll answer your question with a direct answer. We tend to be the laughing stock of Palm Beach County for just this very issue.
Here Lake Worth has a big potential for improvements that can offset the very thing you state is what keeps us down, the small lots the high utility rates, dysfunctional government.
People who know say you cannot possibly build a sustainable hotel on one of our city blocks unless you allow them to include the space they'd need. That means going up. Not Ft. Lauderdale or Miami style, but in the same style that already exists there RIGHT NOW.
But even with these people trying to reason with you, there appears to be NO REASON, which brings us back to why you can't answer the question I posed:
"What might be in dispute is how this amendment helps either that image or our overall economic health.
Could you please explain?"
Want to take another crack at it?
Here is what I don't understand. Why is John Rinaldi (sp?)so in favor of this? He owns a historic "low-rise" B&B right in the area proposed for the hotel district. He is not a realtor nor a developer. His B&B depends on people who come to Lake Worth due to its "charm".
You make the point that all those in favor of not supporting the referendum are doing it for their own greedy reasons.
So why would a guy like John support it unless he thought it was in the best interest of Lake Worth's future. As a small business owner with more "skin in the game" than anyone I can think of I value his opinion.
I would like your view on this Lynn!
I have no idea why John Rinaldi would want heights in the downtown other than it might draw more traffic and congestion. He may "have skin in the game" but so do 35,000 residents in this city. Are they less important than Mr. Rinaldi? They aren't on political appointed boards and it is a proven fact that residents pay more taxes than commercial establishments.
So much for the skin. And if anyone on a board believes their opinion is more valid than those in and who support Respectful Planning PAC, they need to step down immediately.
rinaldi has always been on the other side of poltiics in LW.He was appoitned to this board when the commisison kicked off really good people.What do you expect him to say? they are full of it.
I support the hotel district which will allow 65 feet in height for one reason, we need a hotel desperately. If a hotel needs 65 feet to be built here than I say let them have it. As I read the new law, the hotel district actually protects us from tall buildings. It applies only to the area east of federal and it limits 65 foot buildings to only hotels, nothing else. So that means that in this one small area of the city which already has tall buildings we will allow only a hotel to go to 65 feet. Why would a city with no economic development cut off its legs over 2 stories. Why does everyone believe that the boards will screw the city and the residents? I would never want this city to become a tall city. That's why people come to our B and B. I'm sorry that Lynn so distrusts the city and I know she has cause to feel that way but we have to begin to accept that it's time to get a hotel in our city.
Lynn,real Lake Worther,thank you for your truth Medium,blog,Lynn's little bit of etc.!
The subversives, crooked Realtors looking for quick exclusive Sales rights from developers,while making Citzens pay their taxes, ,like the ugly Lucerne,cost Citizens $1.2 million in tax exemption for Koolik a rich developer. Why did Loratta sharp , the one with cancer, push(public wittnesses) to have it built with 13 violations, and over $1million in Commissions for her and Real Estate Co?
This element wants to turn Lake Worth over to developers, for their millions in Commissions, by making the City tax exempt for all rich developers,with threats and liesbbulding anything they want then run!
City attorney did nothing about our Gulfstream Hotel,gutted,devalued from $16,000,000,- to $2,400,000.- and the City attorney,who gave 2.6 million of our money to Greater bay,has done nothing about it.
Crooks want to build antoher,vacant building with the usual buidling violations??And make us pay their taxes?Turining into a Section 8 hotel!
VOTE YES - AND STOP THE LYING REAL ESTATE COMMISSION HUNTING CROOKS !!!THE GULFSTREAM a Lake Worth HOTEL VACANT FOR 7 YEARS on the National Register of Historic Monuments,which can be taken by Lake Worth.It takes legal knowledge, not crooked selling down the river of an innocent small Town.
rEALTOR CROOKS WILL MAKE US pay for infra sructures,we must pay their property taxes and maintenance of what abortions they have in their twisted minds for Lake Worth.WILLIAM WATERS WITH A MIAMI ARCHITECT(I THAUGH HE WAS!!!)IS ON BOARD WITH THOSE GANGSTERS.Consult the Property Appraisers Office about their odious plans, to undermine a whole Town for their 30 silverlings.They are the thieves of Florida.
William Waters wants to change Lake Worth into Miami with a Miami architect! A real one?I thouhgt he was!.We pay his salary, and he should know that he does not pay our taxes, nor do the crooked Realtors.They don't like it here?
Get lost!
John Rinaldi does not undestand that residents move into Lake Worth and tourists visit and spend time ,because of Lake Worth warm small Town beautiful Old Florida nature,is he that simple???It iss charming,very pretty, key West Style, 2 (two,DEUX, ZWEI,DWA(Russian),DOS,DIO(greek),DUE,NI(Japanese,) story,John, Bed-and- Breakfast Inns like the Sabal Palm House,Mango Inn,etc,
not built like the Lucerne,a concrete box for dehumanizing storage, with 13 violations!!!!John should understand building violations,or does he too promote violating Lake Worth Charter? General Town Mediterranean,Key-West and Federal style low 2 story architecture!Lake Worth has many vacant condos,most of them rebted and 52 more built by Lake Worth CRA for a duplicate Dunbar Village housing for low income and section 8
I hope they covert the condo next to Sabal Palm into low income housing.Facebook,etc., will carry that good news!Ted Johnson did anybody tell you that they will built with tax exemption, which will become our burden.You like, you pay their propeprty taxes!
Ted Johnson,has anyone of those crooks told you that the Realtors want the City(you and 35000 others) to pay their developrs property taxes(they can build with tax exemption)for their rich developers,while they get 6% of any building sale they make?Your taxes will be increased, do you understand?Just vote YES and protect all 35000 Lake Worth Citizen,Taxpayers, from the crooked ,greedy, immoral Realtors,who will get paid for destroying Lake Worth small Town character, which brought you here, not the Lucerne, built with tax exemption for the rich developer!
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